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Post by Chad Olson on Apr 1, 2021 19:25:24 GMT -5
You make a lot of good points, Pete. We'll have to explore these options and see what we come up with. I agree that substituting with "move - 3" isn't a really good comparison, because you can't botch the move and get pinned like you could on the deathjump. |
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Post by Pariah on Apr 1, 2021 19:53:59 GMT -5
Ok... I'm finding this discussion a little confusing... Why does there have to be ANY substitution for the deathjump option at all? As previously stated, every wrestler (including the vintage guys) have a deathjump rating... Therefore, high risk moves can be attempted against those wrestlers, even if they don't attempt those kinds of moves themselves... Just use the standard deathjump chart whenever a wrestler wants to attempt a high risk move against ANY opponent.
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Post by luke929 on Apr 1, 2021 20:09:56 GMT -5
Ok... I'm finding this discussion a little confusing... Why does there have to be ANY substitution for the deathjump option at all? As previously stated, every wrestler (including the vintage guys) have a deathjump rating... Therefore, high risk moves can be attempted against those wrestlers, even if they don't attempt those kinds of moves themselves... Just use the standard deathjump chart whenever a wrestler wants to attempt a high risk move against ANY opponent. I think the idea is, if you wanted to make a "pioneer rules" fed, and have some of the more modern guys compete in it, what would you do to modify their cards to make that work. Not just how to have Randy Savage compete against Frank Gotch, but how to have Savage compete LIKE Frank Gotch, if that makes sense. Eliminating the top rope stuff completely. |
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Post by Pariah on Apr 1, 2021 21:45:58 GMT -5
Ok... I'm finding this discussion a little confusing... Why does there have to be ANY substitution for the deathjump option at all? As previously stated, every wrestler (including the vintage guys) have a deathjump rating... Therefore, high risk moves can be attempted against those wrestlers, even if they don't attempt those kinds of moves themselves... Just use the standard deathjump chart whenever a wrestler wants to attempt a high risk move against ANY opponent. I think the idea is, if you wanted to make a "pioneer rules" fed, and have some of the more modern guys compete in it, what would you do to modify their cards to make that work. Not just how to have Randy Savage compete against Frank Gotch, but how to have Savage compete LIKE Frank Gotch, if that makes sense. Eliminating the top rope stuff completely. That sounds like a pretty complicated endeavor, truth be told... Finding an appropriate substitute for the deathjump option would be the least of your worries... Consider the movesets themselves and how they would need to be adjusted... Just using a couple examples from recent posts... Randy Savage's FLYING ELBOW DROP finisher and RVD's FIVE STAR FROG SPLASH finisher would be rendered obsolete... YIKES! |
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Post by Pete on Apr 1, 2021 22:15:59 GMT -5
For me the contrast in styles between Gotch and Savage is part of the fun of it. But I do see it as a viable option if Gotch is facing someone a little closer to his style but still modern--a guy like Bockwinkel, or if Billy Robinson was ever signed (I've seen just about all the Robinson on tape there is to see and I've never seen him do or attempt a deathjump, even off the second buckle).
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Post by luke929 on Apr 1, 2021 23:05:17 GMT -5
For me the contrast in styles between Gotch and Savage is part of the fun of it. But I do see it as a viable option if Gotch is facing someone a little closer to his style but still modern--a guy like Bockwinkel, or if Billy Robinson was ever signed (I've seen just about all the Robinson on tape there is to see and I've never seen him do or attempt a deathjump, even off the second buckle). I agree with you... I was just using an extreme example to make the point. |
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Post by Pariah on Apr 2, 2021 0:31:08 GMT -5
Even though they don't have the option to perform a deathjump, all of the vintage guys have a deathjump rating on their card... With that being the case, I would just use the standard deathjump chart whenever an opponent wants to utilize that option... And holy snap, walkswithwolf ... I never realized that Lou Thesz does not have the option to attempt a deathjump on his color card - Thanks for pointing that out! Buddy Rogers has a (ch.H) on his card which gives him the option to attempt a deathjump if he desires. Rolling out a match between Moolah and Mildred Burke and just realized that Burke doesn't have the option to execute a deathjump on her card either. |
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Post by walkswithwolf on Apr 2, 2021 4:09:53 GMT -5
The whole acrobatics and Top Rope Stuff was never a thing in early Wrestling.
In these Days the Focus was to show me Wrestling as a legitimate Sports Event.
So more likely amateur Wrestling or like in the Olympic Games.
So it in a Clash of Styles with the more modern Wrestlers.
Gorgeous George has a Deathjump on Offense.
Banning Top Rope Moves would be a huge Problem with the Move Sets of most Cards in the Game.
So you could only hand pick the Wrestlers for such a true Vintage Fed.
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Post by Shon Maxx on Apr 2, 2021 4:10:27 GMT -5
I have an idea for a compromise. Since deathjumps are essentially one wrestler hurling himself at another, the turnbuckle isn't even needed (Granted one option has a suplex off the TB but it's not mandatory). My idea then is for DJ's to be a wrestler lunging at another.
A couple of examples:
1. Crusher tries to perform a running shoulder tackle on Frank Gotch.
-Crusher knocks the wind out of Gotch and goes for the kill.
-Crusher grazes Gotch and continues.
-Gotch jumps out of the way and Crusher falls to the floor.
-Gotch counters with a drop toehold or falling armbar.
2. Danny Hodge attempts a knee clip on Great Gama.
-Hodge clips Gama, knocking him off his feet, and goes for the finish.
-Hodge hits and Gama hobbles a bit.
-Gama picks Hodge up and hurls him into the third row.
-Gama picks Hodge up and hurls him across the ring.
The other side of the card would be an updated Feud chart, with less chance of an injury, or worse, a gang assault. Here are my ideas so far:
-Referee decides match ended in a questionable manner and restarts the match.
-Both wrestlers continue to brawl and are broken up by officials. No injuries.
-Attacker injures opponent.
-Defender injures opponent.
-If wrestler performing assault has an ally, there's a chance (1-2) that the ally joins in, therefore increasing the injury.
Just a couple of ideas.
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Post by walkswithwolf on Apr 2, 2021 5:24:34 GMT -5
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