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Post by wayne on Apr 14, 2023 16:46:25 GMT -5
Far more cards now have a tag wrestler using an alternative move when they roll on their tag finisher during a singles match. However when there is no alternative what do you do? Re roll on L3O? That’s what I thought you were supposed to do. However I saw something online where a roll up at L2O was used instead. I can only find original rules at moment so wonder if this is officially addressed, I am sure it has been
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Post by Pete on Apr 14, 2023 16:48:16 GMT -5
A Ringside Companion from several years ago advocated for rolling up on L2O in that situation. I think the old Legends Ringside Companion.
By re-rolling on L3O, if the tag wrestler has a singles finisher as well, then that's actually a bonus instead of a penalty because now he has a 1-in-5 chance of hitting the finisher instead of 1-in-6.
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Post by wayne on Apr 14, 2023 17:07:57 GMT -5
I think what you say makes perfect sense. Maybe if the wrestler only has a tag finisher listed then they should roll at same L3O on the re roll but if they also have a singles finisher then they should roll up because, as you say, they get an advantage to hit it. I guess if you get 2 tag guys change pace and face off singles but only have a tag finisher available then implementing roll up to weaker L2O may mean that you could be rolling the match all night.
I looked over some of the companions and could not find an official stance. The only thing I found was in the non original FG game instructions and it said
11. DOUBLE TEAM TAG MOVES
A move on offense followed by (tag) means the move only works when the wrestler is involved in a tag team match. In singles matches roll again at the same level of offense until you roll a different instruction. A move on offense followed by (singles) means the move only works in singles matches. In tag matches roll again at the same level of offense until you roll a different instruction”.
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Post by on_the_edge on Apr 14, 2023 17:55:34 GMT -5
For me it depends on the card. If they have a single finisher on 5 and the tag on 6, to me that means they can go for the finish 2/6 the time in tag matches. Why would it be different in single matches. If I roll 6 I use the single finisher from 5. Otherwise, depending on the wrestler, if I roll the tag finisher on 6 and they have no single finisher I just figure some move and make it (0) OR I just roll again on L3O. I do not see penalizing the wrestler because no alternative single move is listed at 6.
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Post by Vegas on Apr 14, 2023 18:40:20 GMT -5
When a wrestler rolls a tag move in a singles match, I always roll up as otherwise you are making a tag wrestler more proficient in a singles match in which they should usually be less proficient and thus making the tag wrestlers much stronger in singles matches than the card writers probably intended.
For LOW for example, lets say Sgt. Slaughter is wrestling Bobby Fulton in a singles match for whatever reason. On Level 3 Offense, Slaughter has his COBRA CLUTCH finisher at 6 so he has a 1 in 6 chance to hit his finisher. Bobby Fulton on Level 3 Offense has his FANTASIC CRADLE singles finisher at 5 and his ROCKET LAUNCHER tag finisher at 6.
If you just reroll on Fulton's Level 3 Offense in that match whenever he hits the ROCKET LAUNCHER then he has a 1 in 5 chance to hit that FANTASTIC CRADLE which is a greater chance than Slaughter has with his 1 in 6 chance to hit his COBRA CLUTCH yet Slaughter is by far the greater singles star.
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Post by Pete on Apr 14, 2023 19:10:24 GMT -5
For me it depends on the card. If they have a single finisher on 5 and the tag on 6, to me that means they can go for the finish 2/6 the time in tag matches. Why would it be different in single matches. If I roll 6 I use the single finisher from 5. Otherwise, depending on the wrestler, if I roll the tag finisher on 6 and they have no single finisher I just figure some move and make it (0) OR I just roll again on L3O. I do not see penalizing the wrestler because no alternative single move is listed at 6. But to me, a guy like Bobby Fulton *should* be penalized. Now, if you've established him as a singles guy in your promotion, or you're playing COTG 2096 and Vlad Hammer is a single after turning heel with no finisher, then okay, make the adjustment. But if he's still teaming with Tommy Rogers but wrestling a one-off on his own, he should be less effective than an established singles guy. |
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Post by TTX on Apr 14, 2023 19:13:12 GMT -5
It's a weird rule (and I don't believe there's any easy way to fix it other than to give them one more move and only tag finishers with any singles finishers)
There's very few Sheepherder types where singles was nearly unheard of for them but go with whatever works. Yeah, they have a 3% better chance at hitting a finisher but it's likely a 0 finisher anyways. They also have a 3% better chance of rolling a -2 move on level 3 offense if they have said move.
(Mind the thing that will always get to me is that charts happen way too much but it would require redoing the rules to change that issue)
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Post by on_the_edge on Apr 14, 2023 19:21:47 GMT -5
For me it depends on the card. If they have a single finisher on 5 and the tag on 6, to me that means they can go for the finish 2/6 the time in tag matches. Why would it be different in single matches. If I roll 6 I use the single finisher from 5. Otherwise, depending on the wrestler, if I roll the tag finisher on 6 and they have no single finisher I just figure some move and make it (0) OR I just roll again on L3O. I do not see penalizing the wrestler because no alternative single move is listed at 6. But to me, a guy like Bobby Fulton *should* be penalized. Now, if you've established him as a singles guy in your promotion, or you're playing COTG 2096 and Vlad Hammer is a single after turning heel with no finisher, then okay, make the adjustment. But if he's still teaming with Tommy Rogers but wrestling a one-off on his own, he should be less effective than an established singles guy. For me it is a question of penalizing the guy because he was pretty much ONLY a tag wrestler and thus not good on his own OR if the penalty is because when the card was made a single alternative for the tag finisher was not included even though the wrestler was solid or better as a single wrestler. If it is the former I feel rolling again on L3O is fine as, why would he "try" a tag finisher in a single match. It just a small flaw. If a guy is on L3O he should get a roll on that, not have to roll on L2O because he rolled a tag finisher. |
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Post by on_the_edge on Apr 14, 2023 19:23:35 GMT -5
It's a weird rule (and I don't believe there's any easy way to fix it other than to give them one more move and only tag finishers with any singles finishers) There's very few Sheepherder types where singles was nearly unheard of for them but go with whatever works. Yeah, they have a 3% better chance at hitting a finisher but it's likely a 0 finisher anyways. They also have a 3% better chance of rolling a -2 move on level 3 offense if they have said move. (Mind the thing that will always get to me is that charts happen way too much but it would require redoing the rules to change that issue) When I play, I only use charts if they are required, or it makes sense for the wrestler to perform the move. Why do a move if the opponent is good in that situation (ie an A)? I will often do the move if they are bad in the situation (ie a C). |
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Post by Vegas on Apr 14, 2023 19:29:25 GMT -5
Yeah, they have a 3% better chance at hitting a finisher but it's likely a 0 finisher anyways. An almost 4% greater chance is bigger than it may seem, at work with grading that is almost half a letter grade. A tag wrestler such as Bobby Fulton should not have an almost 4% greater chance of hitting their finisher than wrestlers such as Roddy Piper, Randy Savage, Buddy Rogers, Sgt. Slaughter, Curt Hennig, etc. |
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