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Post by riffdog on Aug 11, 2017 12:59:15 GMT -5
That looks even f ucking dumber than I was expecting it to. How did we get to the point that shit like this is acceptable? I'm going to take soom heat for this, bit is really that much more stupid then the irish whip? Both are ludicrous and require a massive suspension of disbelief. |
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Post by Swarm on Aug 11, 2017 14:06:54 GMT -5
CM Punk getting obliterated in a real fight proved that everything in wrestling (except Brock Lesnar) requires a massive suspension of disbelief. Wrestling is theater, like movies.
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Post by Pete on Aug 11, 2017 18:26:07 GMT -5
I've seen worse but I don't really care for the false equivalence that says that since the Irish whip is unrealistic, anything goes and dick suplexes and that move are okay, too. I can suspend my disbelief for a lot, but not for a guy blatantly grabbing his own partner around the waist just to execute a contrived spot. I'm not Jim Cornette on this subject but I'm sure closer to him than I am to Joey Ryan and company.
And I love Toru Yano, so I'm not a complete fogey on this matter--but he rarely does anything that ridiculous. The stuff with the hopping-ropes-running with Omega was a little "ehhh," but otherwise he doesn't do anything that you *couldn't* do under the standard accepted premise of a pro wrestling match. He throws low blows, uses weapons, and rolls people up (and Yano was also an elite amateur wrestler and all-around athlete who once ran a marathon and then wrestled afterward, so he has a shred of credibility to all this). He doesn't throw invisible grenades or hypnotize people into dancing.
Trevor Lee and CWF Mid-Atlantic in general are awesome, though.
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PWI set!
Aug 11, 2017 19:14:59 GMT -5
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Post by riffdog on Aug 11, 2017 19:14:59 GMT -5
They aren't false equivalences. They are both 100% impossible. It all depends on the level of realitybof the promotion. Just like in movies.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2017 19:16:21 GMT -5
I've seen worse but I don't really care for the false equivalence that says that since the Irish whip is unrealistic, anything goes and dick suplexes and that move are okay, too. I can suspend my disbelief for a lot, but not for a guy blatantly grabbing his own partner around the waist just to execute a contrived spot. I'm not Jim Cornette on this subject but I'm sure closer to him than I am to Joey Ryan and company. Preach it, brother Pete. And I love Toru Yano, so I'm not a complete fogey on this matter--but he rarely does anything that ridiculous. The stuff with the hopping-ropes-running with Omega was a little "ehhh," but otherwise he doesn't do anything that you *couldn't* do under the standard accepted premise of a pro wrestling match. He throws low blows, uses weapons, and rolls people up (and Yano was also an elite amateur wrestler and all-around athlete who once ran a marathon and then wrestled afterward, so he has a shred of credibility to all this). He doesn't throw invisible grenades or hypnotize people into dancing. Yano is legitimately one of the very best character workers in modern pro wrestling. He knows what he's good at and does it better than anyone else. |
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Post by Pete on Aug 11, 2017 19:54:43 GMT -5
They aren't false equivalences. They are both 100% impossible. It all depends on the level of realitybof the promotion. Just like in movies. I can buy that under the rules of wrestling physics, that grabbing a guy by the arm and pulling it in a proper way will send him into the ropes where he bounces back. I truly can. I cannot buy that sticking a guy's head between his partner's legs will force his partner to wrap his arms around his waist for a piledriver. Sorry, my suspension of disbelief only goes so far. It's a horribly contrived spot even by the standards of contrived spots. If they're doing this stuff in CWF Mid-Atlantic, which is an old-school no-frills type atmosphere as opposed to Chikara, it's worse. Put it this way: Game of Thrones viewers will buy dragons, smoke monsters, and all kinds of mystical quasi-medieval stuff. But if Jon Snow pulls out a cell phone, boom. All suspension is gone. I don't expect wrestling to conform to real world rules, but I expect it to conform to its *own* rules. |
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Post by Vegas on Aug 12, 2017 6:06:10 GMT -5
I can suspend my disbelief for a lot, but not for a guy blatantly grabbing his own partner around the waist just to execute a contrived spot. I know the video posted did not show the setup but the opposing tag team partner does not just "blatantly grab his own partner around the waist." instead the move is typically set up by the Carnies throwing one opponent into the other and then immediately hitting the standing opponent with elbow strikes to collapse him standing up before actually do the move. I am cool with it, they are doing a circus move- but they are a circus like tag team called the Carnies- so it works for me. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2017 12:53:57 GMT -5
I can suspend my disbelief for a lot, but not for a guy blatantly grabbing his own partner around the waist just to execute a contrived spot. I know the video posted did not show the setup but the opposing tag team partner does not just "blatantly grab his own partner around the waist." instead the move is typically set up by the Carnies throwing one opponent into the other and then immediately hitting the standing opponent with elbow strikes to collapse him standing up before actually do the move. I am cool with it, they are doing a circus move- but they are a circus like tag team called the Carnies- so it works for me. Actually the clip posted does in fact show the setup, it also shows the guy blatantly grabbing his partner around the waist so that they're in position to do the destroyer. Why would his partner just stand there hunched over? Why wouldn't he just drop to his knees so they couldn't do the move? Why does the guy who's holding on sell that he got hit for like half a second before he's like oh shit gotta get ready for this dumb ass spot? Why has pro wrestling gotten to the point where stupid shit like this is acceptable? Why do people think this is cool? Wrestling needs a lot less stuff like this and a lot more guys trying to be like Brock Lesnar and to clarify that, I mean guys wanting to be taken seriously and having an aura instead of doing goofy, dumb ass shit like this. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2017 12:55:41 GMT -5
They aren't false equivalences. They are both 100% impossible. It all depends on the level of realitybof the promotion. Just like in movies. I can buy that under the rules of wrestling physics, that grabbing a guy by the arm and pulling it in a proper way will send him into the ropes where he bounces back. I truly can. I cannot buy that sticking a guy's head between his partner's legs will force his partner to wrap his arms around his waist for a piledriver. Sorry, my suspension of disbelief only goes so far. It's a horribly contrived spot even by the standards of contrived spots. If they're doing this stuff in CWF Mid-Atlantic, which is an old-school no-frills type atmosphere as opposed to Chikara, it's worse. Put it this way: Game of Thrones viewers will buy dragons, smoke monsters, and all kinds of mystical quasi-medieval stuff. But if Jon Snow pulls out a cell phone, boom. All suspension is gone. I don't expect wrestling to conform to real world rules, but I expect it to conform to its *own* rules. PREACH. THAT. SHIT. BROTHER. PETE. |
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Post by Vegas on Aug 12, 2017 13:19:22 GMT -5
I know the video posted did not show the setup but the opposing tag team partner does not just "blatantly grab his own partner around the waist." instead the move is typically set up by the Carnies throwing one opponent into the other and then immediately hitting the standing opponent with elbow strikes to collapse him standing up before actually do the move. I am cool with it, they are doing a circus move- but they are a circus like tag team called the Carnies- so it works for me. Actually the clip posted does in fact show the setup, it also shows the guy blatantly grabbing his partner around the waist so that they're in position to do the destroyer. Why would his partner just stand there hunched over? Why wouldn't he just drop to his knees so they couldn't do the move? Why does the guy who's holding on sell that he got hit for like half a second before he's like oh shit gotta get ready for this dumb ass spot? Why has pro wrestling gotten to the point where stupid shit like this is acceptable? Why do people think this is cool? Wrestling needs a lot less stuff like this and a lot more guys trying to be like Brock Lesnar and to clarify that, I mean guys wanting to be taken seriously and having an aura instead of doing goofy, dumb ass shit like this. the clip does show the Carnies throwing their opponents into each other and then the elbow strikes before their finisher (I just posted that in response to Pete's comment that the opponent was just "blatantly grabbing his own partner's waist"- that is not the case,) but what I was trying to say is that it does not show the action leading up to that situation to make it more believable- all you see is the finisher itself. My point remains: it is a circus move by an evil circus tag team called The Carnies. It makes sense to me. I really do not understand the apparent outrage over the move. |
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