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Post by johnandryan on Nov 27, 2011 7:17:59 GMT -5
Cman - Suh has a body of work that supports him being a dirty player. It has nothing to do with tackle vs. flag football nor with the guys being pansies, it has to do with playing within the legal limits of the game.
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Post by Pete on Nov 27, 2011 18:39:45 GMT -5
The last time I checked this was TACKLE Football not FLAG Football. Pretty soon a player is going to get flagged for Unnessecary Roughness for laying one finger on his opponent. Should Suh have stomped on the guy? No, but to label him Dirty because of it is just plain stupid. This is football people, quit turning these guys into pansies and just let them play, if somebody gets hurt, that is just the name of the game. What on earth does stomping on a guy, after the play is over no less, have to do with tackle football? I thought the goal was to tackle the ball carrier. I don't quite get how stomping on a lineman after the whistle accomplishes anything for your team. Anyone who talks up about how today's players "may as well play with tutus" or whatever other cliched BS talking heads like to spout any time an official has the audacity to enforce a rule is only pining for an imaginary fantasy version of the NFL that has never actually existed. Stomping opponents has never, ever been an accepted part of the game. I have nothing against Suh and haven't even seen enough of him to judge whether or not he's "dirty." But he brought this ejection and probable suspension entirely on himself. |
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Post by payback on Nov 27, 2011 19:33:36 GMT -5
Suh is not dirty, he's super aggressive & violent. Just like Ray Lewis.
It's funny how nobody is talking about the Packers' O lineman had bent Suh backwards after the play and wouldn't let him go. Then Suh tries to get up and the guy won't let go so Suh grabs ahold of him and holds his helmet on the ground, then a 2nd GB player grabs his jersey from behind to pull him off, then a 3rd GB player comes in and pushes him. This is all after the play is over. Then Suh being fed up stomps and pushes away from the 3 guys.
But Suh is dirty and will probably get fined & suspended.
Also, I saw an NYJ D lineman throw a BUF RB to the ground after the whistle -- no flag, and nobody said 2 words about it.
I guess perception is reality. Suh shouldn't have stomped the guy, but you can see how he's clearly refereed differently, which adds to his frustration.
Check out what happened at the :50 mark
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Post by swarm on Nov 27, 2011 20:11:03 GMT -5
I could not agree less with anything that I have read in this thread so far. As a non-Lion fan, I think the Lions are definitely chippy, definitely emotionally immature, and commit far too many penalties such as this that ultimately hurt their own team. Do I think Suh intentionally was holding the lineman's head down and slamming it into the ground because he would not let him go? No - it was a method of intimidation - one I used to use in my high school and college career myself - but as I look back on it, using guys as tables are not one of the points to be proud of. I feel personally that Suh is dirty and Raiola is dirty. I respect VandenBosch and his style of play. You can keep all your "swagger" and all of the gangster-rapper false bravado. I know as an opposing coach that Suh is going to lose his cool and hurt his team then I am going to push him at every turn, and now that I know the officials are looking out for him, all the better. He has brought all of this on himself with his style. Just be honest - yes, I was frustrated and overreacted - but you don't stomp a guy unless you are auditioning for American History X. I remember getting stomped myself once. I went back to the huddle, came off the ball like a mother the next play and put my helmet in my opponent's esophagus. He hit the ground like a safe, and next play - same result. Do what you need to do within the legal limits of the game. and please, all of you spare me about the talk of what goes on in and underneath the piles, how QB's are sissies, etc. I know all of this and it is the same point always made. Stop being chippy. Play with a chip on your shoulder within the legal limits of the game. that means - just win. This post makes me wish I was blind. I guess everyone forgets about the guy from MN stomping the GB lineman in the BALLS a few weeks ago. There's a reason players are kicking at these guys. And it's not because they're angels. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2011 20:21:53 GMT -5
The NFL players themselves voted Suh as the dirtiest player in the league...by a landslide. And I'm supposed to not take their word? Why? Sorry, but I think that NFL players know their own sport and their own colleagues more than anyone posting here, myself included. Then a former Nebraska teammate says the same thing. Are this guy's statements somehow the media's fault? Well that's impossible. There'd be no story without the incident. Suh clearly couldn't control his temper and stomped someone while the whole country was watching. Then he follows the incident up with some whack public statement, denying the stomp. Then, a backtrack and apology a day later? Suh's inability to handle the press following his own blunder shouldn't be blamed on the media. I don't care if the guy is young, common sense tells you to own up to your mistake, apologize right away, and take whatever punishment they give you like a pro. You're being watched by the entire world and paid millions. Act like it. Look, Suh is an absolute BEAST, obviously. But according to the rest of the NFL, the media in general, most fans, and my own eyes (on more than just this occasion), dude is DIRTY. And all that said, I'd still give my left nu...er..arm to have him on my team!  |
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Post by johnandryan on Nov 27, 2011 20:49:58 GMT -5
I could not agree less with anything that I have read in this thread so far. As a non-Lion fan, I think the Lions are definitely chippy, definitely emotionally immature, and commit far too many penalties such as this that ultimately hurt their own team. Do I think Suh intentionally was holding the lineman's head down and slamming it into the ground because he would not let him go? No - it was a method of intimidation - one I used to use in my high school and college career myself - but as I look back on it, using guys as tables are not one of the points to be proud of. I feel personally that Suh is dirty and Raiola is dirty. I respect VandenBosch and his style of play. You can keep all your "swagger" and all of the gangster-rapper false bravado. I know as an opposing coach that Suh is going to lose his cool and hurt his team then I am going to push him at every turn, and now that I know the officials are looking out for him, all the better. He has brought all of this on himself with his style. Just be honest - yes, I was frustrated and overreacted - but you don't stomp a guy unless you are auditioning for American History X. I remember getting stomped myself once. I went back to the huddle, came off the ball like a mother the next play and put my helmet in my opponent's esophagus. He hit the ground like a safe, and next play - same result. Do what you need to do within the legal limits of the game. and please, all of you spare me about the talk of what goes on in and underneath the piles, how QB's are sissies, etc. I know all of this and it is the same point always made. Stop being chippy. Play with a chip on your shoulder within the legal limits of the game. that means - just win. This post makes me wish I was blind. I guess everyone forgets about the guy from MN stomping the GB lineman in the BALLS a few weeks ago. There's a reason players are kicking at these guys. And it's not because they're angels. I can always submit this in braille to you so you can still read it. I didn't forget it at all - just sticking to discussing this particular issue - Suh and supporting my position. That's the point and the argument being discussed. |
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Post by swarm on Nov 27, 2011 21:40:32 GMT -5
The NFL players themselves voted Suh as the dirtiest player in the league...by a landslide. And I'm supposed to not take their word? Why? Sorry, but I think that NFL players know their own sport and their own colleagues more than anyone posting here, myself included. from copy and pasted article - "I’m not necessarily saying dirty but just aggressive and intense," Arizona Cardinals linebacker Daryl Washington said of his vote for Suh. "I’m on the defensive side of the ball. I like the way he plays. I wouldn’t mind having a guy like that in front of me.” So the one guy they decided to quote for their "Dirtiest Player in the League" story actually says he's not dirty --- instead says he is "just aggressive and intense" --- and this is the only quote from any player in the league that voted Suh by a "landslide"? Give me a break. Then, a backtrack and apology a day later? Suh's inability to handle the press following his own blunder shouldn't be blamed on the media. I don't care if the guy is young, common sense tells you to own up to your mistake, apologize right away, and take whatever punishment they give you like a pro. You're being watched by the entire world and paid millions. Act like it. He gets heat for not apologizing then when he does apologize and does it the right way, accepting his punishment he's "back-tracking". No win situation. Who cares that he apologized, he didn't do it fast enough. Look, Suh is an absolute BEAST, obviously. But according to the rest of the NFL, the media in general, most fans, and my own eyes (on more than just this occasion), dude is DIRTY. In 2011 dirty means something different than it used to in regards to football. Suh is dirty in Roger Goodell's hipster tampon party era but he's not dirty compared to the guys who paved his road. I'm happy to see everyone bagging on the Lions and bagging on Suh. To be frank, it was annoying seeing the nation jump on the Lions bandwagon. Most everyone has treated the Lions and their fans like dirt for the better part of the last decade. The media, fans of other teams...I've seen Lions fans take more abuse than any other fan base. Then the Lions got good and everyone wanted to jump on board. I'm glad that shit is over. |
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Post by tystates on Nov 27, 2011 21:57:59 GMT -5
It's funny how nobody is talking about the Packers' O lineman had bent Suh backwards after the play and wouldn't let him go. Then Suh tries to get up and the guy won't let go so Suh grabs ahold of him and holds his helmet on the ground, then a 2nd GB player grabs his jersey from behind to pull him off, then a 3rd GB player comes in and pushes him. This is all after the play is over. Then Suh being fed up stomps and pushes away from the 3 guys. Not how it happened. He was on top and grabbed the guy's helmet and slammed it to the ground twice, got up and then stomped him. They tried to pull him off cause he was slamming their teammates head on the ground. |
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Post by payback on Nov 27, 2011 22:16:51 GMT -5
It's funny how nobody is talking about the Packers' O lineman had bent Suh backwards after the play and wouldn't let him go. Then Suh tries to get up and the guy won't let go so Suh grabs ahold of him and holds his helmet on the ground, then a 2nd GB player grabs his jersey from behind to pull him off, then a 3rd GB player comes in and pushes him. This is all after the play is over. Then Suh being fed up stomps and pushes away from the 3 guys. Not how it happened. He was on top and grabbed the guy's helmet and slammed it to the ground twice, got up and then stomped him. They tried to pull him off cause he was slamming their teammates head on the ground. You couldn't be more wrong. The GB guy never lets go of Suh until his teammate pushes him. Suh didn't slam his head into the ground. His helmet came up about 3 millimeters then put back down, all the while he's holding onto Suh. If he wanted Suh off of him, all he had to do was let go. Suh isn't gonna take that crap. Didn't you see Suh get slammed to the ground after the play was over? That's why he was pissed, if you can't see that I can't help you. |
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Post by swarm on Nov 27, 2011 23:11:34 GMT -5
This post makes me wish I was blind. I guess everyone forgets about the guy from MN stomping the GB lineman in the BALLS a few weeks ago. There's a reason players are kicking at these guys. And it's not because they're angels. I can always submit this in braille to you so you can still read it. I didn't forget it at all - just sticking to discussing this particular issue - Suh and supporting my position. That's the point and the argument being discussed. And it has two sides, one of which is the Packers O line. What exactly are these cheese dicks heads doing that is making their opponents kick at them? |
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